How long did Defendants know about the Forgery before making it public?
It turns out that in order to protect the trust that Jamati institutions have with the Jamat, the defendants had not publicized their knowledge of forgery until after the Lawsuit was filed when they no longer had the choice.
[Note: Extracts of Federal Court Transcripts of Cross-Examinations held August 2010 for Summary Judgement Motions in the Aga Khan Copyright Lawsuit
Sections starting with N. Tajdin #... Means Nagib Tajdin is the one answering questions in the next section
Sections starting with Jiwa #... Means Alnaz Jiwa is the one answering questions in the next section
Sections starting with Sachedina #... Means Shafik Sachedina is the one answering questions in the next section
Sections starting with Bhaloo #... Means Aziz Bhaloo is the one answering questions in the next section
N. Tajdin #152 - 158:
Cross-Examination by Mr Gray.
Q. ...You received the letter that is now Exhibit 3, as you said, by e-mail?
A. First by e-mail, then I insisted to receive the original...
A. ...and I received it after quite a long time, maybe three weeks.
Q. Right. And you said...
A. And I had to insist many, many times to get the original.
Q. And you received the original when?
A. Sometime in February, mid-February.
Q. February 13?
A. That is likely.
Q. But in the meantime, you sent the photocopy, didn't you, or the electronic copy you had received, you sent it to two experts for examination?
A. Yes, I did.
N. Tajdin #179:
Cross-Examination by Mr Gray.
Q. Based on that, you are accusing Ms. Parkes of criminal behaviour, are you not?
A. Actually, it is not only because of the expertise. The content of the report...you know, for an Ismaili who will read this letter, it is very evident that His Highness has not written this letter, but the expertise was needed for people who are not Ismaili, who cannot, from reading the letter, know that this is not written by the Imam.
Q. I asked you a simple question. Based on the...at this point, you received only a photocopy of the letter...
N. Tajdin #187 - #251:
Cross-Examination by Mr Gray.
Q. Okay. But will you agree with me that...okay, let's deal with the next one. And you circulated this allegation of forgery, did you not, to other people?
A. I sent...yes, I sent to a couple of people.
Q. Who did you send it to?
A. I will not give you names.
A. If you want reason, I will give you reason why. Do you need a reason why...
Q. Sure. Why are you not giving me the names of the people you sent it to?
A. In this file, whenever there is a name which goes out, for example, Karim Alibhay, he gets harassed the whole day and night, he gets phone calls, threats, so I am not going to give any names.
Q. All right.
A. It would not be fair for the people, right?
Q. Right. But in any event, you circulated it to people who you knew were going to circulate it to other people?
Q. You circulated...
A. No, when I circulated, it was under
the understanding that this was to be contained.
A. Even when I received the letter from...one of the original, from the president of the Aga Khan council in Nairobi, I had a small discussion with him, and he told me he didn't want me to talk to anyone about it, and I said, 'No, it has to be contained, because people will lose faith in the leadership if they know these things are happening'.
Q. So, then, you...
A. And it was not...
Q. How many people did you send the...
A. A couple of them.
Q. A couple of them? Two people, you sent the notice...
A. Two or three.
Q. ...you told them...two or three?
Q. At that point?
Q. Subsequently, you said you told other...
A. Well, after the lawsuit, it was apparent that everything would come to the light, so...
Q. Even before the lawsuit, you sent it to other people, didn't you?
Q. Even before the lawsuit, it was widely known on the Ismaili Heritage website, wasn't it?
A. Before the lawsuit, no, absolutely not. There was nothing on that subject on ismaili.net before the lawsuit.
Jiwa #206 - #253:
Cross-Examination by Mr Gray.
Q. Yes. So, when did Mr. Tajdin tell you about the forgeries of the letters, the alleged forgeries of the letter of January 24 or February 18?
A. I don't recall the exact date, but it was in...when he received the first letter. It may have been the very day or the next few days is when he told me that he had received a letter.
Q. And at that point he told you it was a forgery?
A. I don't think at that point he told me, but I was actually in disbelief when he told me that he has received a letter.
Q. You didn't believe that His Highness would have sent a letter telling you not to do it?
A. Yes. I was in disbelief and I said, 'You know what? I don't believe it'. The funny thing is he didn't send me a copy of the letter.
Q. Who is 'he'?
A. Mr. Tajdin did not give me a copy. He just told me that on the phone. and...
Q. So, you were in a state of disbelief
A. I was, yes. I was.
Q. But did Mr. Tajdin tell you at that time that the letter was a forgery?
A. You know what? I don't think he told me the very first day. I think he told me maybe a few days later.
Q. A few days later.
A. A few days later.
Q. Before he had sent it to an expert. He just knew it was a forgery?
A. Yes, before he sent it.
A. I suggested, I said, you know...actually, Nagib told me his mother told him that from the letters that she has, this is not Imam's signature at all. So I told Nagib, I said, 'Look, when we have a situation like that, we send it to an expert'. So I found the two names and I said, 'Let's send it for them'.
Q. And so you helped him send the two...the letters to an expert?
A. I didn't help him send. He sent it straight, because even after we received the reports, I did not see the letter.
Q. You didn't see the letter. But you saw the reports?
A. I saw the reports.
Q. And did you give the experts any instructions as to what to do?
A. No, I did not communicate with the experts, except for one I paid for. I paid for one of the experts.
Q. Which expert?
A. I would have to look it up. One of the two.
Q. One of the two, Carlson or Petinatti. I'm sorry, Carlson or...
A. Because, you know, Nagib's...
Q. It was not Ospreay, though?
A. Ospreay...the first two experts... one of the two I paid. One of the two I paid. Nagib's credit card was not going through. She was trying to ring it through and it wouldn't be accepted, so Nagib told me if I can pay. So then I paid from here.
A. I don't know. One of the two.
Q. Petinatti or Carlson?
Q. Right. Okay. And how many other people did Mr. Tajdin tell about the forgeries?
A. In terms of experts?
Q. No, no, just in terms of people. He told you about the forgery; right?
A. I don't know. You know, the person that I buy the books from, I discuss with him.
Q. So he knew about the forgery?
Q. This is the distributor of the books?
A. This is the distributor, yes.
Q. Or the alleged forgery.
A. The alleged forgery, right.
Q. And who else did Mr. Nagib tell? A. You know, I really don't know. I mean, Mr. Tajdin and I, although I have known him for almost some 20 years, but we have never been, sort of, friends. We have never visited...I have never visited his home or he my home. We essentially met at some seminars that...at first I met him when he organized a seminar on our Khojki...it is known as a Khojki script.
A. So, we have never been in a sense friends that I associated with. I mean, my interest from Nagib was just to get the Farmans from him.
Q. So, who else did you tell about the forgeries, then?
A. At the time it happened?
A. At the time it happened, I didn't discuss it with anybody.
Q. February, 2010.
A. I don't recall telling others.
Q. And when is the first time you told someone else about the forgery?
A. After the litigation started.
Q. After the litigation.
Q. After what day?
A. Whatever. It was in April. I first told my mom.
A. I first told my mother.
Q. You first told your mother.
A. Of course.
Q. That is sweet.
A. She was at my home...so I did tell her.
Q. But that was after the litigation...
Q. ...was started.
Q. Do you remember when you told her about the forgeries?
A. To whom?
Q. When did you tell your mom?
A. I told my mom after the litigation started.
Q. Well, the litigation started in April.
A. Yes. I don't remember the date, but it was in April. I know after the litigation started.
Q. Was it before you filed your Statement of Defence...
Q. ...alleging the forgeries?
A. After that, I was telling everybody, including my sister. My whole family was in shock, of course.
Q. This was after you filed or when you filed the Statement of Defence?
A. Yes. Because before filing the Statement of Defence, the issue of even the prohibition and stuff was technically not public. And finally it was Mr. Tajdin who sort of...I don't even know all the distributors. I just know...
Q. The distributors all knew, and presumably they were telling people buying the books that...there were people...
A. At that time?
Q. Well, let's put it this way...
A. Before the litigation or after the litigation? There is a big difference between the two. Before the litigation...I am talking about before the litigation at the moment.
Q. Yes. Right.
A. Before the litigation, the only person who knew was Mr. Tajdin. Then he told me. And then there is this one distributor that I buy books from. I discussed with him about this.